A Series Cutting Out (Metro 1275)

[Stuffed]

Well, the diesel's all gone, and the misfire turned out to be a leaky
manifold gasket (causing a fault on only one cylinder, not 2, which is why I
thought it was something else).

But every so often the engine just cuts out, although liberal amounts of
choke pick it back up if I'm quick enough. Most often seems to do this
either when flooring it, or when trickling along at part throttle, in
traffic. It's also running far too rich, or at least smells that way, but
any leaner and it runs rough. My first thought is the carb is worn, maybe a
combination of faults including where the spindle goes through, and possibly
float. But before I play with it (I think I've got a spare somewhere), I've
also noticed the rev counter often twitches when the car seems to be ticking
over OK - I have my suspicions this is ignition circuit related.

As it's got the electronic "points" dizzy, I'm not sure I want to start
trying to diagnose any ignition fault unless I can be fairly sure there is
one to start with! Does it sound like a flaky coil or ignition module could
be a part of the problem?

[Colin Stamp]

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 20:36:24 +0100, "Stuffed" <talking@rse.non> wrote:

>Well, the diesel's all gone, and the misfire turned out to be a leaky
>manifold gasket (causing a fault on only one cylinder, not 2, which is why I
>thought it was something else).
>
>But every so often the engine just cuts out, although liberal amounts of
>choke pick it back up if I'm quick enough. Most often seems to do this
>either when flooring it, or when trickling along at part throttle, in
>traffic. It's also running far too rich, or at least smells that way, but
>any leaner and it runs rough. My first thought is the carb is worn, maybe a
>combination of faults including where the spindle goes through, and possibly
>float. But before I play with it (I think I've got a spare somewhere), I've
>also noticed the rev counter often twitches when the car seems to be ticking
>over OK - I have my suspicions this is ignition circuit related.
>
>As it's got the electronic "points" dizzy, I'm not sure I want to start
>trying to diagnose any ignition fault unless I can be fairly sure there is
>one to start with! Does it sound like a flaky coil or ignition module could
>be a part of the problem?
>

I had a similar problem on an MG Metro years ago. It turned out to be
a split in the fuel hose between the floor and the engine. When I
loaded the engine and it rocked on it's mounts, the split would open
up and the pump would suck in a great wodge of air.

Cheers,

Colin.

[Guy King]

The message <ckk02t$co8$1@news.freedom2surf.net>
from "Stuffed" <talking@rse.non> contains these words:

> As it's got the electronic "points" dizzy, I'm not sure I want to start
> trying to diagnose any ignition fault unless I can be fairly sure there is
> one to start with!

First things first - with any SU carburettor you always need to check
that the dashpot's topped up, particularly if you've had it off recently
(Ooooher, missus) 'cos that's when you lose the oil.

--
Skipweasel.
Being superstitious brings bad luck

[Stuffed]

"Guy King" <guy.king@zetnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:3130303034323739416D9BC769@zetnet.co.uk...
> The message <ckk02t$co8$1@news.freedom2surf.net>
> from "Stuffed" <talking@rse.non> contains these words:
>
> > As it's got the electronic "points" dizzy, I'm not sure I want to start
> > trying to diagnose any ignition fault unless I can be fairly sure there
is
> > one to start with!
>
> First things first - with any SU carburettor you always need to check
> that the dashpot's topped up, particularly if you've had it off recently
> (Ooooher, missus) 'cos that's when you lose the oil.

First thing I did when the car turned up :)

First thing I do when I get any SU carbed car in fact :)

Although the HiF damper seems to blow the excess through the carb, not as
much fun as the old HS where you'd brim it then hold the throttle wide open
whilst asking someone to keep a close eye on the carb ;)

[Stuffed]

"Colin Stamp" <colin@stamp.plus.com> wrote in message
news:v03rm0h0o13uphm82gus482d7hbjv7d02g@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 20:36:24 +0100, "Stuffed" <talking@rse.non> wrote:

> >As it's got the electronic "points" dizzy, I'm not sure I want to start
> >trying to diagnose any ignition fault unless I can be fairly sure there
is
> >one to start with! Does it sound like a flaky coil or ignition module
could
> >be a part of the problem?
> >
>
> I had a similar problem on an MG Metro years ago. It turned out to be
> a split in the fuel hose between the floor and the engine. When I
> loaded the engine and it rocked on it's mounts, the split would open
> up and the pump would suck in a great wodge of air.

Oh buggeration, not another fuel line fault. I was really really hoping it
wasn't that *again*, after recently having exactly that go wrong with my
older car. There are some similar symptoms, like smell of petrol every so
often but not from engine bay or rear, the cutting out... But I was hoping
it was something else, I'm starting to hate fuel lines! Especially as I've
just had the joys of trying to make one out of a Fiesta line and random
unions for a Moggie pick up. That one seems to have discovered the joys of
high rev misfire now, will rev up nicely, but then stutter and die. Couldn't
be bothered to check anything today, was just glad the fuel line was
working!

I'll get under the car some time soon and double check - I take it it's a
metal line, most likely gone on the bend where it's hardest to get at?

[mrcheerful]

"Stuffed" <talking@rse.non> wrote in message
news:ckk02t$co8$1@news.freedom2surf.net...
> Well, the diesel's all gone, and the misfire turned out to be a leaky
> manifold gasket (causing a fault on only one cylinder, not 2, which is why
> I
> thought it was something else).
>
> But every so often the engine just cuts out, although liberal amounts of
> choke pick it back up if I'm quick enough. Most often seems to do this
> either when flooring it, or when trickling along at part throttle, in
> traffic. It's also running far too rich, or at least smells that way, but
> any leaner and it runs rough. My first thought is the carb is worn, maybe
> a
> combination of faults including where the spindle goes through, and
> possibly
> float. But before I play with it (I think I've got a spare somewhere),
> I've
> also noticed the rev counter often twitches when the car seems to be
> ticking
> over OK - I have my suspicions this is ignition circuit related.
>
> As it's got the electronic "points" dizzy, I'm not sure I want to start
> trying to diagnose any ignition fault unless I can be fairly sure there is
> one to start with! Does it sound like a flaky coil or ignition module
> could
> be a part of the problem?
>
>

Most likely IME is that the filter in the carb is blocked. Unbolt the carb
and invert it, remove the four screws and the bottom plate, unscrew the
float pin from the side and remove the float, lift the float valve away with
the float, using a socket undo the float valve seat and there is the filter,
it is quite tiny so blocks up very easily, blow and wash it clean and
reassemble.

You may be able to guess that I have done this quite a few times.

mrcheerful

[Stuffed]

"mrcheerful ." <nbkm57@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:IChbd.8034$xb.4223@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk ...
>
> "Stuffed" <talking@rse.non> wrote in message
> news:ckk02t$co8$1@news.freedom2surf.net...


[Poor Running]

>
> Most likely IME is that the filter in the carb is blocked. Unbolt the
carb
> and invert it, remove the four screws and the bottom plate, unscrew the
> float pin from the side and remove the float, lift the float valve away
with
> the float, using a socket undo the float valve seat and there is the
filter,
> it is quite tiny so blocks up very easily, blow and wash it clean and
> reassemble.

Ah, thank you :)

Just what I half expected, and very much hoped, to hear :) I've only used
HiFs a handful of times, more familiar with the HS2s and 4s myself, so never
had this exact problem, but it did strike me as carb related, just that rev
counter glitch that perturbed me. Never knew there was a filter in the carb
though, never had one of the few I've used apart before!

> You may be able to guess that I have done this quite a few times.

Wish I had, I wouldn't have had to ask! :)

[Stuffed]

Well, it wasn't a crapped up needle valve :(

Although I did manage to lose the needle out the carb somewhere in teh
engine bay, so had to take a trip in a cab to get my spare carb. Still, I
needed to get the carb off to seal the exhaust/ manifold joints I suppose,
although would've been nice to save the taxi fare.

I tried to provoke it again today, and it started cutting out after a
hundred yards or so in second with my foot firmly on the boards (but nowhere
near the red line), and also after a bit of engine breaking/ trickling the
throttle in some traffic in town. There's often a bit of a whiff of petrol
as well, so I am wondering if it is the leaky fuel line problem, it got too
dark and too rainy to investigate that today.

I'm still concerned about the twitchiness of the rev counter, it can bounce
a good few hundred rpm for no good reason, mainly around 1.5 to 2.5 thousand
IIRC, although I tend to keep my eye on the road more than the tacho!

[Dave Plowman (News)]

In article <ckk02t$co8$1@news.freedom2surf.net>,
Stuffed <talking@rse.non> wrote:
> As it's got the electronic "points" dizzy, I'm not sure I want to start
> trying to diagnose any ignition fault unless I can be fairly sure there
> is one to start with! Does it sound like a flaky coil or ignition module
> could be a part of the problem?

Electronic distributors tend to work or not. Can be intermittent, though,
but unlikely to give just a poor spark.

--
*Age is a very high price to pay for maturity.

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

[Stuffed]

"Dave Plowman (News)" <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4cfdf880bddave@davenoise.co.uk...
> In article <ckk02t$co8$1@news.freedom2surf.net>,
> Stuffed <talking@rse.non> wrote:
> > As it's got the electronic "points" dizzy, I'm not sure I want to start
> > trying to diagnose any ignition fault unless I can be fairly sure there
> > is one to start with! Does it sound like a flaky coil or ignition module
> > could be a part of the problem?
>
> Electronic distributors tend to work or not. Can be intermittent, though,
> but unlikely to give just a poor spark.

That was what the BOL said, but I don't put much faith in that lot since the
phrase "take to your nearest garage" seemed to become an answer for filling
the washer bottle on most cars. But I've never had an A with the electronic
bits before, or even many cars at all with that new fangled pointless
system..

I am still thinking along the lines of either an ignition fault or rev
counter glitch being the reason the counter flickers around quite often, but
I'm less than convinced that's the actual cause of the main problem - It
feels like fuel issues to me, seems others reckon it's a fuel issue, I've
just got to trace which bit of the system is having the blasted issue. The
carb got a pretty good going over today, so it's lines next time I get
chance. The odd thing is the part or closed throttle, and WOT both seeming
to show the same problem.

Still, it can only be carb, pump lines or tank on the fuel, and coil or
dizzy on the ignition (leads, plugs cap and arm have all been chopped and
changed for known good ones through all of this), so I'll get there in the
end :)

Just been so long since I really got oily on an A series, and one that I
need to use daily, it's good to be able to get some advice :)

[Chris Street]

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 20:36:24 +0100, Stuffed wrote:

> Well, the diesel's all gone, and the misfire turned out to be a leaky
> manifold gasket (causing a fault on only one cylinder, not 2, which is why I
> thought it was something else).
>
> But every so often the engine just cuts out, although liberal amounts of
> choke pick it back up if I'm quick enough. Most often seems to do this
> either when flooring it, or when trickling along at part throttle, in
> traffic. It's also running far too rich, or at least smells that way, but
> any leaner and it runs rough. My first thought is the carb is worn, maybe a
> combination of faults including where the spindle goes through, and possibly
> float. But before I play with it (I think I've got a spare somewhere), I've
> also noticed the rev counter often twitches when the car seems to be ticking
> over OK - I have my suspicions this is ignition circuit related.
>

My 1300 Metro MG did this. It turned out I had my fuel line wrapped around
the exhaust manifold (Yes I know - it was only like that for the first 24
hours of my ownership though!)

Fuel line gets hot - fuel boils and blows through the car and engine stalls
out. Reeks of petrol, and if you are quick enough pulling the choke it
seems to dose it with enough petrol to keep it going till the next load of
neat petrol comes through the line. Then the line warms up the cold fuel
etc etc.

Not suggesting you routed the line oddly but you did just say you were
mucking around with a leaky manifold gasket.....